Results 1 to 24 of 24
  1. #1
    Maroon Eagle's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    A Vienna Sewer Tunnel
    Posts
    8,756

    Georgetown ranks 4500 Colleges' Return on Investment Rankings...

    From Georgetown's Center on Education and the Workforce:

    There are different ways to rank colleges.

    Millsaps has the longterm highest return of investment of any college or university in Mississippi followed by Ole Miss and Mississippi State in third.

    While MSU is third in-state, it ranks just in the top third nationally (around 31 percent or so) -- and compared to neighboring states to give an example-- it is below UAB (and would be 12th in Alabama). Ole Miss would be tenth in Alabama behind the University of Alabama.
    "This is so Clarion-Ledger. If anything is true in this state about the corporate and corporate-funded media, it's that they are firmly in the University of Mississippi's pocket. They pander to the perceived powerful over and over and over and over again, even in sports. We all know it. It's one of those Mississippi things." -- Donna Ladd, September 16, 2018


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Maroon Eagle View Post
    From Georgetown's Center on Education and the Workforce:

    There are different ways to rank colleges.

    Millsaps has the longterm highest return of investment of any college or university in Mississippi followed by Ole Miss and Mississippi State in third.

    While MSU is third in-state, it ranks just in the top third nationally (around 31 percent or so) -- and compared to neighboring states to give an example-- it is below UAB (and would be 12th in Alabama). Ole Miss would be tenth in Alabama behind the University of Alabama.
    This is what people should really be upset about. If academics were college football, state fans would be rioting in the streets.


    1 out of 1 sixpackers like this post
    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  3. #3
    Maroon Eagle's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    A Vienna Sewer Tunnel
    Posts
    8,756
    Exactly. People talk about making sure the enrollment grows. It's not going to grow as much if we go only by ROI.


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  4. #4
    Dawgbite's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    State of Disbelief
    Posts
    2,166
    Didn't read the article but the problem with these national rankings is the Ayers Case. With the Ayers ruling the Universities in Ms admit so many people who would not be in a four year university in other states. It's not comparing apples to apples when the admission standards are not the same.


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  5. #5
    Maroon Eagle's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    A Vienna Sewer Tunnel
    Posts
    8,756
    You're right. It's not comparing apples to apples, but it's telling us who our apples are when it comes to ROI.

    Right now, our equivalent apple in Alabama is not Auburn (the top school in ROI in its state) or Bama, it's UAB.
    Last edited by Maroon Eagle; 12-05-2019 at 04:00 PM.


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Madison, Alabama
    Posts
    12,087
    Quote Originally Posted by msugolf View Post
    This is what people should really be upset about. If academics were college football, state fans would be rioting in the streets.
    That's for sure. In fact, with the Joe situation they practically ARE rioting in the streets, but few seem to be very upset when our academics fall. Of couse, we don't have any "academic" boards to post about such things; SPS is supposed to be "all things MSU", but it's really just about sports.


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Madison, Alabama
    Posts
    12,087
    Quote Originally Posted by Dawgbite View Post
    Didn't read the article but the problem with these national rankings is the Ayers Case. With the Ayers ruling the Universities in Ms admit so many people who would not be in a four year university in other states. It's not comparing apples to apples when the admission standards are not the same.
    Exactly, and that's a shame.


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  8. #8
    Holy shit that is deplorable.
    I searched a bunch of state schools around me and where I grew up, as well as a lot of private colleges around me and where I grew up- none are even in the thousands. These are institutions that graduated co-workers who are not even close to as smart as many I sat near at MSU.
    That ranking is so bad, MSU should pay us to attend.

    Rankings are like most everything when it comes to numbers- fun to manipulate.
    We have a shamingly bad score in this Georgetown analysis, but then we are also a 'best value'- https://www.msstate.edu/newsroom/art...ge-mississippi.


    0 out of 2 sixpackers like this post
    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Dawgbite View Post
    Didn't read the article but the problem with these national rankings is the Ayers Case. With the Ayers ruling the Universities in Ms admit so many people who would not be in a four year university in other states. It's not comparing apples to apples when the admission standards are not the same.
    Quote Originally Posted by RocketDawg View Post
    Exactly, and that's a shame.

    So, as one who didnt grow up in MS or even know about the Ayers case while I was at MSU, can you guys provide detailed info on why the Ayers case has 'caused' this?

    What I know about the Ayers case without googling-
    - HBCUs in MS were disproportionally underfunded for decades and a case took a quarter century to resolve for some reason(i bet it isnt a good one).
    - HBCUs have been paid a bunch of money for 20 years to offset/make up for the racist neglect of funding them properly for decades prior.
    - HBCUs have struggled to enroll white students and that was in some way a requirement for the payments.


    So assuming those 3 info nugs are correct and accurately describe(in a general way) the Ayers case, how is the Ayers case responsible for Mississippi State being so low in the rankings? Is MSU required to accept anyone who meets admission standards? Other schools certainly can deny admission even though the students meet and often times exceed the requirements.



    Follow up- if MSU's score is low because students were admitted that werent ready, isnt that similar to community colleges and jucos?...those scores would presumably be lower than Harvard, Tulane, Stanford, Northwestern, etc and for good reason.
    I think what this shows, if this is how to interpret the data, is that Mississippi's best and brightest should look elsewhere for their degree to hold more value.
    Last edited by mstateglfr; 12-05-2019 at 05:04 PM.


    0 out of 2 sixpackers like this post
    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  10. #10
    And this is probably why my HS junior will not be going to MSU. His initial test scores are good enough to get in a lot of schools that are much higher on the list than MSU and the cost is relatively the same. By the way, what has MSU done to attempt to offset some of the Ayers situation? Have we petitioned the Feds for any relief? I don't see why the State of MS is alone in this. Are you telling me that every other Southern State was different than MS?


    0 out of 1 sixpackers like this post
    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  11. #11
    Message Board Hero 8dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,444
    Is there something to account for the difference in cost of living? Because otherwise this seems like an obvious conclusion. Schools like state and om that have more students than anyone choose to live in a state that pays less than any other are always gonna show a lower ROI.


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by 8dog View Post
    Is there something to account for the difference in cost of living? Because otherwise this seems like an obvious conclusion. Schools like state and om that have more students than anyone choose to live in a state that pays less than any other are always gonna show a lower ROI.
    There is not that much difference in cost of living in other Southern States. There is a huge difference in Mass. and MS, but not MS and AR, LA, etc. I can build a house in Houston cheaper per sq. ft. than in Starkville.


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  13. #13
    Message Board Hero 8dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,444
    Well i really meant salary. You are gonna make significantly less in jackson than you are in nashville or atlanta for comparable jobs. So again, its a really obvious conclusion

    i thought it was well agreed upon that college degrees are commoditized. Im at the point where im gonna make my kids go in state


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by 8dog View Post
    Well i really meant salary. You are gonna make significantly less in jackson than you are in nashville or atlanta for comparable jobs. So again, its a really obvious conclusion
    I see your point, but MSU is going to have to do something. Until the State of MS funds higher education to proper levels (which I don't see in the near future), MSU is going to rely more and more on alumni donations, a lot of which is big money from out of state. Those alums have less incentive to give to MSU if their kids don't want to go there, or if the alums don't feel like their kids want MSU on a resume any more. Quite frankly, the academic status of MSU is becoming a bit embarrassing.
    Last edited by The Usual Suspect; 12-05-2019 at 06:46 PM.


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Dawgbite View Post
    Didn't read the article but the problem with these national rankings is the Ayers Case. With the Ayers ruling the Universities in Ms admit so many people who would not be in a four year university in other states. It's not comparing apples to apples when the admission standards are not the same.
    And higher dropout rates are counted against the school, thereby hurting us twice.


    1 out of 1 sixpackers like this post
    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by The Usual Suspect View Post
    And this is probably why my HS junior will not be going to MSU. His initial test scores are good enough to get in a lot of schools that are much higher on the list than MSU and the cost is relatively the same. By the way, what has MSU done to attempt to offset some of the Ayers situation? Have we petitioned the Feds for any relief? I don't see why the State of MS is alone in this. Are you telling me that every other Southern State was different than MS?
    You can do anything you want to do coming out of MSU if you apply yourself. My son recently graduated and he is in grad school at, one of the very top schools in the world. Those rankings don't mean a dang thing.


    1 out of 1 sixpackers like this post
    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  17. #17
    Dawgbite's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    State of Disbelief
    Posts
    2,166
    Quote Originally Posted by mstateglfr View Post
    So, as one who didnt grow up in MS or even know about the Ayers case while I was at MSU, can you guys provide detailed info on why the Ayers case has 'caused' this?

    What I know about the Ayers case without googling-
    - HBCUs in MS were disproportionally underfunded for decades and a case took a quarter century to resolve for some reason(i bet it isnt a good one).
    - HBCUs have been paid a bunch of money for 20 years to offset/make up for the racist neglect of funding them properly for decades prior.
    - HBCUs have struggled to enroll white students and that was in some way a requirement for the payments.


    So assuming those 3 info nugs are correct and accurately describe(in a general way) the Ayers case, how is the Ayers case responsible for Mississippi State being so low in the rankings? Is MSU required to accept anyone who meets admission standards? Other schools certainly can deny admission even though the students meet and often times exceed the requirements.



    Follow up- if MSU's score is low because students were admitted that werent ready, isnt that similar to community colleges and jucos?...those scores would presumably be lower than Harvard, Tulane, Stanford, Northwestern, etc and for good reason.
    I think what this shows, if this is how to interpret the data, is that Mississippi's best and brightest should look elsewhere for their degree to hold more value.
    Iím no expert and may be way off on this but here is my understanding. The jist of the lawsuit was that admission requirements at State,OM,and Southern were discriminatory toward minorities and thus steering them toward the HBCUís Per the settlement the historicity white schools had to lower admission standards to meet a quota of minorities. As schools in neighboring states have steadily raised admission requirements, Ms schools have had to keep requirements lower per the Ayers case. OM has used this to recruit Texas and Georgia to get the kids with daddyís money who were denied admission to their home state schools. This is why your noose hanger was from Georgia and your alleged murder was from Texas.


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  18. #18

    You mean Millsaps who came to MSU for help teaching classes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Maroon Eagle View Post
    From Georgetown's Center on Education and the Workforce:

    There are different ways to rank colleges.

    Millsaps has the longterm highest return of investment of any college or university in Mississippi followed by Ole Miss and Mississippi State in third.

    While MSU is third in-state, it ranks just in the top third nationally (around 31 percent or so) -- and compared to neighboring states to give an example-- it is below UAB (and would be 12th in Alabama). Ole Miss would be tenth in Alabama behind the University of Alabama.
    And is struggling to keep the doors open? They are down to about 750 students. Also, how much debt does the avg Millsaps grad leave school with?

    https://www.msstate.edu/newsroom/art...degree-program


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  19. #19
    Exactly.

    My son graduated from a 5A public school in MS. 4.0 in high school with 29 act. He is graduating from MSU this spring with a Chem Eng degree. He co-oped the past 2 summers with 2 different companies. 1 in Bama and 1 in MS. Received offers from both and also offers from 2 other out of state companies.
    He accepted a position 2 weeks ago, starting June 1st, with an Arkansas company. Total starting annual package, $92k.

    So, HAIL to a STATE education!!


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  20. #20
    Maroon Eagle's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    A Vienna Sewer Tunnel
    Posts
    8,756
    Millsapsí issue isnít unusual as you know. Itís a small liberal arts collegeó and a lot of liberal arts colleges throughout the country are experiencing difficulties because students arenít going into those programs as often as they had been in the past.

    Millsaps has historically attracted smarter, academically inclined students whoíve generally gone on to graduate school hence their high longterm return on investment. Lately though, they have been losing students to public universities.

    I like Millsaps. Iíve long considered it to be the best undergrad college in the state. I know folks who are employed there & family members whoíve attended it (it was also my second choice undergrad school behind MSU). I hope things improve for them.


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  21. #21
    ROI is return on investment or how much you make verses how much you spent for your education.
    This is driven by the jobs in Mississippi and earning potential. This is not about the quality of your education. OM is most likely above us because they have a higher percentage of out of state students who go home to GA or TX and can make more money.
    Mississippi needs higher paying industries.
    Itís that simple...Now go figure out how to attract high paying industries.


    3 out of 3 sixpackers like this post
    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  22. #22
    Maroon Eagle's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    A Vienna Sewer Tunnel
    Posts
    8,756
    Agreed. Mississippi needs better paying industries to stop the brain drain. And MSU also needs to continue (as well as expand) recruiting out-of-state students.


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by The Usual Suspect View Post
    And this is probably why my HS junior will not be going to MSU.
    This is laughable. Very rarely does success in your career have anything to do with where you go to college.


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

  24. #24

    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    San Antonio, TX
    Posts
    70
    Yep, and when you leave the MS for work or stay in MS even, nobody knows where Millsaps or UAB ranked relative to State on some random ranking.

    There are only a handful of schools in the country where a degree from that program really will get you much further.

    It's about YOU and your ability to interview and/or and create. Period.


    Pounding faces | Pounding sand Yes | No

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
SixPack Sponsors







Disclaimer: Neither this message board nor its rules and regulations are associated with Mississippi State University or any other Mississippi State sports website. Neither this message board nor its rules and regulations are associated with Scottish & Newcastle PLC d/b/a Bulldog Strong Ale. The views and opinions expressed herein are strictly those of the post author. The contents of this page have not been reviewed or approved by SixPackSpeak.com. The interactive nature of the SixPackSpeak.com Discussion Forums makes it impossible for SixPackSpeak.com to assume responsibility for any of the content, including photographs and/or images, posted by participants. The ideas, suggestions, thoughts, recommendations, opinions, comments, advice, and observations made by participants of the interactive Discussion Forums are not endorsed by SixPackSpeak.com.


Partner of USA TODAY Sports Digital Properties