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  1. #1

    Serious question about recruiting

    Why should we show commits on a board if its only purpose is to make them targets for other schools? These kids change their minds like they do their clothes. Just show zero commitments until signing day.


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  2. #2
    Same can be said about coaches. It’s just the way the game works. No need in getting worked up over it. Signing day 2011 I left a class early at State, so I could get on the computers in the library to check see if we were going to get CJ Johnson, Nick Brassell, or Tobias Singleton. When we got none of those, I stopped following recruiting and I’ve been much happier.

    I check our list on signing day now.


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  3. #3
    Please stop starting stupid threads.

    Asking for a friend.


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  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Requiem For A Dawg View Post
    Same can be said about coaches. It’s just the way the game works. No need in getting worked up over it. Signing day 2011 I left a class early at State, so I could get on the computers in the library to check see if we were going to get CJ Johnson, Nick Brassell, or Tobias Singleton. When we got none of those, I stopped following recruiting and I’ve been much happier.

    I check our list on signing day now.
    Exact same scenario with me. My thinking now is that regardless of who signs with us, that's who I will be cheering for so why pay money to follow all the drama. I'm about like Dan Mullen.....I HATE RECRUITING!


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  5. #5

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    You don't have to pay to follow recruiting. There is a lot of free info out there.


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  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by msu86 View Post
    Exact same scenario with me. My thinking now is that regardless of who signs with us, that's who I will be cheering for so why pay money to follow all the drama. I'm about like Dan Mullen.....I HATE RECRUITING!
    And go back and looked at Ole Miss’s highly touted 2011 class. Our lowly #41 ranked class blew theirs out of the water in terms of what the players actually did in college.


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  7. #7
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    Same here, I don't want to even hear who we signed until they are announced as a starter in a couple years
    The poster formerly known as: dawgebag


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  8. #8
    If you want to feel good about recruiting, you need to follow Alabama.


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  9. #9
    Do "other schools" really peruse message boards to get their recruiting info ? Who knew ?


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  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by PirateDawg View Post
    Why should we show commits on a board if its only purpose is to make them targets for other schools? These kids change their minds like they do their clothes. Just show zero commitments until signing day.
    If this depresses you… when the big schools with lots of rich alumni really gets the money laundering through the NIL in full swing.. you are really gonna feel let down.


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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Requiem For A Dawg View Post
    And go back and looked at Ole Miss’s highly touted 2011 class. Our lowly #41 ranked class blew theirs out of the water in terms of what the players actually did in college.
    That 2011 class actually turned around Ole Miss' program. They pretty much kicked our ass with those guys.

    We signed a good class too in hindsight but theirs' was better.


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  12. #12
    It’s Goat….again.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkTheDawg View Post
    If this depresses you… when the big schools with lots of rich alumni really gets the money laundering through the NIL in full swing.. you are really gonna feel let down.
    Tell me again, how exactly this is going to change the rankings?


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  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Smoked Toag View Post
    Tell me again, how exactly this is going to change the rankings?
    Rankings shmankings. Rankings won’t matter. But when single schools start signing 15 to 20 of the best players in high school football to single classes, rankings isn’t going to matter a bit. The rankings will be bigger schools with people that love to throw around money farther up there while smaller schools with less rich alumni will be farther down there.

    that will be your rankings. Measuring the divide that will be ever increasing.


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  14. #14
    It’s Goat….again.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkTheDawg View Post
    Rankings shmankings. Rankings won’t matter. But when single schools start signing 15 to 20 of the best players in high school football to single classes, rankings isn’t going to matter a bit. The rankings will be bigger schools with people that love to throw around money farther up there while smaller schools with less rich alumni will be farther down there.

    that will be your rankings. Measuring the divide that will be ever increasing.
    Annnnnd.....how exactly will that be a change from now?


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  15. #15
    Rich folks have nicer things than po folks **


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  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Shmuley View Post
    If you want to feel good about recruiting, you need to follow Alabama.
    This is kind of funny. I hung out with Andrew Bone (an Alabama 24/7 guy) a few years back at a wedding. After that I started following him on Twitter, and have ever since regretted it.

    All they get is good news.


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  17. #17
    Other schools are well aware of the commits that show up here. If you do a little research you'll see just how many 4 star recruits we have leaning our way who are waiting until the 15th. The final count is going to move us into the top 15 I believe


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  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Requiem For A Dawg View Post
    And go back and looked at Ole Miss’s highly touted 2011 class. Our lowly #41 ranked class blew theirs out of the water in terms of what the players actually did in college.
    I think that was another OM team that made it to the Sugar Bowl wasn't it? Why does OM's recruiting in 2011 matter in MSU's recruiting in 2022? Oh that's right, as long as we can beat OM nothing else matters. After all we have our baseball program and OM's baseball program is 5th rate at best


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  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by THE Bruce Dickinson View Post
    This is kind of funny. I hung out with Andrew Bone (an Alabama 24/7 guy) a few years back at a wedding. After that I started following him on Twitter, and have ever since regretted it.

    All they get is good news.
    It does get ridiculous watching Alabama and Georgia get the 5 stars they want before anyone else gets a chance. Remember Nakobe Dean? He is far and away the best linebacker in college football now and someone that should be playing for us now. But, he's at Georgia. For the foreseeable future I see Alabama, Georgia, then the rest of the SEC contrary to what people in south Louisiana seem to think. I would be my life that after this recruiting season we'll be hovering around the 10 to 15 rank for a few years at the end of the season


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  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by WalkTheDawg View Post
    Rankings shmankings. Rankings won’t matter. But when single schools start signing 15 to 20 of the best players in high school football to single classes, rankings isn’t going to matter a bit. The rankings will be bigger schools with people that love to throw around money farther up there while smaller schools with less rich alumni will be farther down there.

    that will be your rankings. Measuring the divide that will be ever increasing.
    They can only put 11 players on the field at a time. God forgive me for the punishment i'm about to take, but Texas A&M and yes Ole Miss managed to beat those unbeatable Alabama teams twice with much lesser classes somehow


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  21. #21
    If you don't think that these kids are known outside of us offering/accepting their commitment, you are missing a lot. We see a fraction of what happens. These coaches from all over know these kids, where they are leaning, etc.


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  22. #22
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    I give this post 3 stars!


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  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Smoked Toag View Post
    Annnnnd.....how exactly will that be a change from now?
    Seriously? Prior to NIL… Alumni had no way to directly pay players without risk of being caught and placing the program on probation. At least the inability to pay players left that even between schools.

    now it’s a free for all. What will change is the gap will get wider and money will flow to players right out in the open. USC, Oregon, Texas, Texas A&M, Notre Dame, Michigan, Ohio State, etc just got an advantage, over the advantage they already had, in the recruiting game.

    What is the change is Alabama has went from “you will play for championships here. What are the chances you will in Mississippi?” Now it’s, “Come to Alabama and earn a minimum NFL salary as well as play for championships. You wanna get a few hundred a month and not play for championships in Mississippi?”

    For example, If a 5 star QB was in the golden triangle and they really wanted their family to see them play, that gave us a foot in the door against.. say.. an Ohio State. However… now an alumni/booster can funnel money through a podunk travel agency somewhere in Ohio to fly their family right out of GTR and provide them first class accommodations right to the gate of the stadium. Juuust for that QB to make a few radio spots for the company. The travel agency gets free exposure, the QB gets his wish, and the booster gets the QB.

    that’s the difference. Money just has to be funneled through businesses to players and it’s perfectly legal now.
    Last edited by WalkTheDawg; 12-07-2021 at 11:55 AM.


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  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by msu0580 View Post
    They can only put 11 players on the field at a time. God forgive me for the punishment i'm about to take, but Texas A&M and yes Ole Miss managed to beat those unbeatable Alabama teams twice with much lesser classes somehow
    Well we have put 11 players on the field against Bama since we last beat them in… 2007. There is a reason for that… and no it’s not just one man who is rumored to speak directly to the football gods.


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  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by msu0580 View Post
    Other schools are well aware of the commits that show up here. If you do a little research you'll see just how many 4 star recruits we have leaning our way who are waiting until the 15th. The final count is going to move us into the top 15 I believe
    Not sure if we end up that high, but we could end up really close to 20, hopefully under. And that would be strong.


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  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkTheDawg View Post
    Seriously? Prior to NIL… Alumni had no way to directly pay players without risk of being caught and placing the program on probation. At least the inability to pay players left that even between schools.
    Yeah alright buddy. Probation was for stupid people.

    Quote Originally Posted by WalkTheDawg View Post
    now it’s a free for all. What will change is the gap will get wider and money will flow to players right out in the open. USC, Oregon, Texas, Texas A&M, Notre Dame, Michigan, Ohio State, etc just got an advantage, over the advantage they already had, in the recruiting game.

    What is the change is Alabama has went from “you will play for championships here. What are the chances you will in Mississippi?” Now it’s, “Come to Alabama and earn a minimum NFL salary as well as play for championships. You wanna get a few hundred a month and not play for championships in Mississippi?”

    For example, If a 5 star QB was in the golden triangle and they really wanted their family to see them play, that gave us a foot in the door against.. say.. an Ohio State. However… now an alumni/booster can funnel money through a podunk travel agency somewhere in Ohio to fly their family right out of GTR and provide them first class accommodations right to the gate of the stadium. Juuust for that QB to make a few radio spots for the company. The travel agency gets free exposure, the QB gets his wish, and the booster gets the QB.

    that’s the difference. Money just has to be funneled through businesses to players and it’s perfectly legal now.
    You act as if this money grows on trees. The effect is WAAAAAY over-embellished. There are 371 4 or 5 star recruits out there, about half of those guys may get some money before college. And about half of them will actually be swayed by the money (probably much less than that).

    Some of you just have no idea how real life works.


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  27. #27
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    “Rankings Don’t Matter” is a common phrase that fans of mediocre football programs use to justify their poor recruiting performance annually. MSU doesn’t invest in recruiting. We average about 50th in NCAA and last in SEC in $ spent on recruiting. We actually overperform compared to what our spend is, but what could we do if we actually invested in recruiting with more staff, resources, etc?


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  28. #28

    Dollars Talk!

    Quote Originally Posted by THE Bruce Dickinson View Post
    This is kind of funny. I hung out with Andrew Bone (an Alabama 24/7 guy) a few years back at a wedding. After that I started following him on Twitter, and have ever since regretted it.

    All they get is good news.
    Booster recruiting is strong at Bummer!


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  29. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Leeshouldveflanked View Post
    “Rankings Don’t Matter” is a common phrase that fans of mediocre football programs use to justify their poor recruiting performance annually. MSU doesn’t invest in recruiting. We average about 50th in NCAA and last in SEC in $ spent on recruiting. We actually overperform compared to what our spend is, but what could we do if we actually invested in recruiting with more staff, resources, etc?
    Rankings don't matter because rating services rank recruits based on who's recruiting them. Alabama isn't great because they have great recruiting classes. Alabama is great because they they do a great job analyzing on their own, and recruit the players they want and coach them up to be successful. Recruiting services are lazy and let programs like Alabama/Georgia/Clemson do the work for them. Our #22-25 classes would be rated closer to top 10 for the same players if our name was Alabama. THAT'S why recruiting rankings are a farce. If they meant something, you'd never see schools like Cincinnati or Utah competing at the highest levels.


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  30. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Shmuley View Post
    If you want to feel good about recruiting, you need to follow Alabama.
    I don't need to follow Alabama and nobody else does for that matter. They get who they want for the amount of money it takes to get them. They will be #1 because they are committed to getting the best players. We, on the otherhand, are battling for players with the mid level SEC teams. I guess the best thing to do is just abandon paying attention to it. Rich boosters will decide who goes where.


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  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drebin View Post
    Rankings don't matter because rating services rank recruits based on who's recruiting them. Alabama isn't great because they have great recruiting classes. Alabama is great because they they do a great job analyzing on their own, and recruit the players they want and coach them up to be successful. Recruiting services are lazy and let programs like Alabama/Georgia/Clemson do the work for them. Our #22-25 classes would be rated closer to top 10 for the same players if our name was Alabama. THAT'S why recruiting rankings are a farce. If they meant something, you'd never see schools like Cincinnati or Utah competing at the highest levels.
    Utah? They lost to San Diego State, Oregon State and BYU this year. They have the benefit of playing in the PAC 12 and Cincinnati we will see how their talent matches up against a very young BAMA team.


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  32. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Leeshouldveflanked View Post
    Utah? They lost to San Diego State, Oregon State and BYU this year. They have the benefit of playing in the PAC 12 and Cincinnati we will see how their talent matches up against a very young BAMA team.
    They also beat Oregon twice and won the Pac 12. They were ranked about 40 last year while Oregon was 6 in recruiting.

    My point is that these teams would not be playing at the level they are if recruiting rankings matter. Cincinnati beat Notre Dame and we can all agree that Notre Dame on paper is much more talented. Cincinnati barely cracked the top 50 last year while Notre Dame was top 10. It's more likely that the talent disparity is not as big as you think - and kids at Notre Dame got the Notre Dame bump in recruiting, while the Cincinnati kids didn't because they were only going to Cincinnati.


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  33. #33
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    Utah’s football recruiting budget is more than double ours. They spend around $1.1 Million per year on football recruiting… MSU and Cincinnati spend roughly about the same around $500K .
    UGA spends around $3.6M, BAMA $2.6M , Ole Miss $1M …


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  34. #34
    Notre Dame has signed one 5-star player total from 2015-2021. Notre Dame doesn’t post Top 10 recruiting classes year in and year out. 10 is kind of their peak. They usually fall between 10 and 15, which is a wide distance from teams that are routinely in the Top 10. There is a MUCH bigger talent gap between #1 and #10 than there is between #10 and #25 even. Notre Dame doesn’t recruit to a level that would make them immune to dropping a game vs Cincinnati. There is a reason Notre Dame embarrasses itself every playoff. Alabama, Georgia, Ohio State, etc have MUCH more talent.


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  35. #35
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    I expect State's to increase considering that the amount of out-of-state recruiting has gone up.


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  36. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by PirateDawg View Post
    Why should we show commits on a board if its only purpose is to make them targets for other schools? These kids change their minds like they do their clothes. Just show zero commitments until signing day.
    new to the world of recruiting?


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  37. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Leeshouldveflanked View Post
    Utah’s football recruiting budget is more than double ours. They spend around $1.1 Million per year on football recruiting… MSU and Cincinnati spend roughly about the same around $500K .
    UGA spends around $3.6M, BAMA $2.6M , Ole Miss $1M …
    Their recruiting budget is more than our because of their location. They have to fly all over the west to recruit because they don't grow four star defensive linemen on trees in their backyard like we do. And yet, they rarely crack the top 40 in national rankings.

    This is not that difficult to understand, Lee.


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  38. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Bulldog from Birth View Post
    Notre Dame has signed one 5-star player total from 2015-2021. Notre Dame doesn’t post Top 10 recruiting classes year in and year out. 10 is kind of their peak. They usually fall between 10 and 15, which is a wide distance from teams that are routinely in the Top 10. There is a MUCH bigger talent gap between #1 and #10 than there is between #10 and #25 even. Notre Dame doesn’t recruit to a level that would make them immune to dropping a game vs Cincinnati. There is a reason Notre Dame embarrasses itself every playoff. Alabama, Georgia, Ohio State, etc have MUCH more talent.
    Going back five years, Notre Dame was in the top 10 three out of the five years. Their other two were 15.


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  39. #39
    It’s Goat….again.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bulldog from Birth View Post
    Notre Dame has signed one 5-star player total from 2015-2021. Notre Dame doesn’t post Top 10 recruiting classes year in and year out. 10 is kind of their peak. They usually fall between 10 and 15, which is a wide distance from teams that are routinely in the Top 10. There is a MUCH bigger talent gap between #1 and #10 than there is between #10 and #25 even. Notre Dame doesn’t recruit to a level that would make them immune to dropping a game vs Cincinnati. There is a reason Notre Dame embarrasses itself every playoff. Alabama, Georgia, Ohio State, etc have MUCH more talent.
    This is truth. Those top 1-5 teams just have significantly more talent than anybody else. And to Drebin's point, that's because they have the most 5 and 4 stars, which are easier to grade. Everybody can pick the top guys, doesn't take a brain surgeon. The projectable ones get dicey.

    But even then, it's flawed. If you look at the past 5 years, here are the teams that have cracked the top 5, and the number of times:

    Alabama, Georgia - 5
    Ohio State - 4
    LSU - 3
    Clemson, USC, Texas - 2
    Texas A&M, Michigan - 1

    USC and Texas have done nothing across that span. All except Alabama/Georgia/Ohio State are up and down. I think it's pretty obvious that spanning at minimum 2 back to back top 5 classes are what it takes.


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